Proposition 50K1657

Proposition de résolution relative à la situation économique et sociale de l'Argentine ainsi qu'aux événements qui secouèrent le pays en décembre 2001.

General information ¶

Authors

PS | SP Yvon Harmegnies, Yvan Mayeur
Vooruit Dirk Van der Maelen

Submission date

Feb. 26, 2002

Official page

Visit

Status

Adopted

Requirement

Simple

Subjects

Argentina economic conditions resolution of parliament political situation social situation

Voting ¶

Voted to adopt

Groen CD&V Vooruit Ecolo LE PS | SP Open Vld N-VA MR

Abstained from voting

FN VB

Contact form ¶

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Discussion ¶

April 18, 2002 | Plenary session (Chamber of representatives)

Full source

I refer to the written report.

Mr. Speaker, Mr. Minister, dear colleagues, the House Committee on Foreign Relations has examined the proposal for a resolution that we will — I hope — vote soon. It is about the grave situation that Argentina is experiencing today. This country and its population must face an extremely significant economic, social and political tension. Argentina had, however, been the subject of a drastic plan of savings imposed by the International Monetary Fund. by

However, as stated in the resolution, this Fund is not always able to propose balanced and development-related measures, as well as the social and health situation of the inhabitants of these countries, who are faced with even more difficult situations when a crisis aggravates the country’s economic problems.

The resolution highlights this situation and calls on the Belgian government to take initiatives, in collaboration with other European countries, in order to restore relations with Argentina, which is an important and modern country of Latin America. It represents for us an important partner on the economic, social, cultural and political levels. I recall that many of the nationals of this country and neighboring countries have immigrated to our country long ago. These people reside in our country in a sustainable way but they remain obviously sensitive to the situation in their country of origin.

I would like to thank the members of the committee, and in particular Mr. Jacques Simonet, for having made a constructive contribution to the drafting of this proposal.

On behalf of the Minister of Foreign Affairs, I will make a few comments on this proposal for a resolution. Given the seriousness of the economic and social problems faced by Argentina and the resulting political crisis, the situation must be carefully studied. In this context, the Minister of Foreign Affairs welcomes this proposal for a resolution on which he expresses his general agreement. by

However, he makes a few comments on the wording of the text. by

Regarding point E, to say that the International Monetary Fund behaves “as a private credit dispenser, without taking into account in its positions, the social consequences of its actions” seems to me a little nuanced vision. First of all, it should be emphasized that the IMF is helping countries whose macroeconomic situation, the resulting social circumstances for the population and the financial structures would not allow any intervention by private credit providers, except at exorbitant interest rates. by

While the IMF is primarily focused on supporting the international monetary and financial system, it takes social and environmental objectives into account in its positions. by

The International Monetary Fund, the World Bank and the U.S. Development Bank are working closely together to support the Argentine population in this difficult situation. The U.S. Development Bank is ready to accelerate lending to help the country meet its most pressing social needs, such as education, health care and food needs.

As regards point F, I would like to emphasize that the representatives of the Member States, including Argentina, are part of the decision-making bodies of the International Monetary Fund. The terms of the IMF intervention are negotiated with the government of the country concerned, which is in no way discharged from its political responsibility.

Finally, once the agreements are concluded, it is the governments of the States that must take the necessary measures aimed at saniting the public finances under the agreed conditions and, indeed, sometimes with a reduced margin of manoeuvre. Most countries are also of the opinion that the international financial architecture and the institutions of Bretton Woods need to be reformed. It is planned that a paragraph in this sense will be introduced in the texts currently in preparation for the Second Summit of Heads of State and Government of the European Union, Latin America and the Caribbean, which will take place in May 2002 in Madrid.

With regard to point I, globalization is, in my view, not a fatality that has been imposed on us. It is the result of a deeply human instinct that pushes man towards change and we must have the courage to face this responsibility. A political concept that could meet the challenge of a globalized society and guide the process of globalization is imperative. Together, we must commit ourselves to its implementation, so that the opportunities and challenges offered to us by globalization benefit as many people as possible.

I confirm that the Government has taken note of the considerations of the draft resolution and that it will do what is necessary to follow it. I would just like to draw attention to some of the initiatives the government has taken in this direction. by

In paragraph 1, on the initiative of the Belgian Presidency, the European Union demonstrated its support to the Argentine people on 27 December 2001. In January, this support was reiterated in a statement by Ecofin ministers. by

In point 2, Belgium and its partners have repeatedly insisted, within the European Union, that a realistic and sustainable global solution to the crisis should be sought, taking into account both the Argentine people and international financial obligations.

Regarding point 3, namely the provision of additional appropriations, the Belgian representative of the IMF Executive Committee has always demonstrated a thoughtful and moderate approach.

Finally, in point 4, the situation in Argentina remains on the agenda of the activities of the PESC-Latin America Working Group. The EU ambassadors in Buenos Aires are following the situation closely. Their conclusions and proposals for action for the European Union are regularly discussed in the Colad Committee. by

I would simply like to add that, within the framework of the Monetary Fund, contacts will again take place, next weekend, with the Argentine Minister of Finance to examine the possibilities of extending the measures to help resolve the crisis in Argentina. But, I repeat, on the whole proposal, there is obviously no objection. On the contrary! by

These are the few clarifications I wanted to make in confirming that we will continue to work on this situation during the meetings of the Monetary Fund and the World Bank.

Does anyone ask the word? (No) Somebody asks-t-il yet the word? (No) The discussion is closed. The discussion is close.

De door de commission aangenomen text geldt als basis voor bespreking. (Rgt.66,4) The text adopted by the committee serves as the basis for discussion. (Rgt.66,4) There will be no amendments in the past. No amendments have been submitted or re-submitted. Voting over the resolution will take place later. The vote on the draft resolution will take place at a later date.

The fight against racism has been at the heart of the mission of the United Nations since its foundation. The principle of non-discrimination is the pillar of its Charter, the Declaration of Human Rights and international human rights pact. Article 1 of the Universal Declaration of Human Rights of 1948 states: “All men are born free and equal in dignity and rights. It is stated in this historical document that everyone, without distinction of color, gender, language and religion, can take advantage of human rights and fundamental freedoms.

What balance can we draw from the observance of these great principles 50 years later? Progress has obviously been made to make equality a respected principle in law and in practice through the adoption of multiple international instruments on human rights, in particular a treaty prohibiting racial discrimination. Apartheid has failed. Science has also categorically buried the notion of a biological or physiological justification that treated individuals unequally. Their dreams were only half-fulfilled. Race discrimination, xenophobia, slavery or its traditional or contemporary forms and other forms of intolerance continue to ravage our societies.

The World Conference Against Racism, Racial Discrimination, Xenophobia and Related Intolerance was held in South Africa in September 2001. It was a unique opportunity to create a new global vision to combat racism in the 21st century. The meeting focused on practical steps to eradicate racism by determining ways to ensure compliance with international standards and instruments. It also made recommendations for further actions to combat prejudice and intolerance. The Conference had a set of objectives on its agenda, including the formulation of concrete recommendations for the adoption of new measures at national, regional and international levels aimed at combating all forms of racism, racial discrimination, xenophobia and associated intolerance. by

I would like to recall the special and strong role that Belgium played in this conference, in particular, through the voice of our Deputy Prime Minister and Minister of Foreign Affairs, Louis Michel.

The objective we pursue through this resolution proposal is double. On the one hand, ensure parliamentary monitoring of the concrete implementation of an international convention and on the other hand, ask the government to look at the state of our national legislation on the fight against racism and xenophobia. The Centre for Equal Opportunities probably has a decisive driving role in this area of competence. It will analyze the Action Programme adopted in Durban to propose its concrete translation by various legislative or regulatory provisions in Belgian law and by concrete actions planned as part of a multiannual plan. Parliament will then have to incorporate these different provisions into legislation. We know that we are at the beginning of a very long process that will probably extend over several legislatures so that all the recommended measures can mature and be implemented in a timely manner.

Finally, we want Durban’s findings to be published and presented in the school community as a pedagogical aspect so that, under the guidance of their teachers, students become more aware of the dangers of racism and xenophobia and take concrete initiatives to combat these plagues, initiatives aimed at promoting the values of solidarity, mutual respect, tolerance and cultural diversity.

The resolution of our colleagues Simonet and Bacquelaine was approved without amendment. The Minister of Finance wishes to take the floor instead of Mr. Minister of Foreign Affairs.

Mr. Speaker, as you know, at the World Conference against Racism in Durban last September — Mr. Bacquelaine referred to this — the Foreign Minister personally invested in ensuring his success.

This conference was of crucial importance in the fight against contemporary forms of racism. The adopted texts are the expression of a genuine political will to end racism. That is why I am pleased to see the real willingness of the Belgian Parliament to implement the acquis of Durban and to integrate them into the mechanism that our country already has in the fight against racism and xenophobia. I therefore firmly support this project which concrete the commitments that Belgium has undertaken at the international level.

Regarding more specifically the requests addressed to the Government and concerning the Ministry of Foreign Affairs, I would like to assure you, first of all, of the full readiness of this Administration to participate in any consultation aimed at concrete translation of the provisions of Durban. I can already inform you that contacts are ongoing with the Centre for Equal Opportunities on this subject. Now that this conference is over and the documents have been finalised, their implementation is one of the priorities of the government. Belgium has also used its diplomatic contacts to encourage the implementation of the Durban Action Programme.

At the international level, the UN General Assembly adopted last February three resolutions introduced by the G77 group and co-sponsored by the European Union, which will enable effective follow-up of the conference.

The ongoing session of the UN Human Rights Commission also addresses the issue of racism and racial discrimination and also deals with the Durban Conference. Belgium and the European Union uphold their principled positions and re-act in favour of the effective implementation of the provisions of the Conference.

On the European regional level, the Council of Europe, for its part, held an ad hoc meeting on 27 and 28 February, in order to carry out an exchange of views on the implementation of the conclusions of the European and World conferences against racism. Belgium has called for a concrete implementation of the provisions contained in the Durban Documents. States that wish to do so may send their national action plan to the Council of Europe so that it makes a compendium of it that can serve as a source of inspiration and ideas for Member States and will ensure, in my opinion, a certain consistency in the lines of action recommended by each country.

This is what I would like to say on behalf of the Government on this proposal.

I would like to speak for a moment in the general discussion.

It will not happen so often that I give the Minister of Finance the right, but when I just asked for the word, he made it clear that the conference is done. Well, he has no wrong. The conference was held in Durban. However, contrary to what he has told here — a story which I am convinced he does not believe; he is too intelligent to do so — the conference has become a big flop, "un raté général", as he would say. There was almost nothing happening there. If you don’t believe me — and it will be so, because I am only a damn Flemish Blocker — then I refer to the press reports about the events in Durban last summer. He knows very well that in Durban it was mainly a dispute, not about racism, not about problems concerning somewhere in the world, but about the conflict in the Middle East, which at the moment has taken tragic dimensions. In fact, 80 percent of the talk in Durban was about the Palestinians and Israel, and about Israel and the Palestinians. For ten days, the conference has had a huge spectacular value. I would almost dare to say that it was a world circus of size.

With the conclusions presented here, the conference had little or nothing to do. Indeed, at the very end of the day, one has adopted only a text that is rigid in political correctness and full of political expressions currently usual, but which has very little concrete content. We are now expected to approve this text. The Flemish Blok faction will not do that, not because it would be racist, as it is permanently claimed, but simply because we are dealing with a conference that was an empty box and has become a total flop.

The consequences, which you find in the preceding text, are, however, very strange. Thus, we must ensure that youth is educated anti-racistly through education.

I must admit that this hardly disturbs me. Let us face the truth and dare to talk to humanities students of this time. They follow antiracism in the lesson History; they get antiracism in the lesson Religion; they get antiracism in the lesson Moral; they get antiracism in the lessons Dutch, French, English and German. If one had found at Caesar a text that could be used in that sense, then they would even get antiracism at Caesar and at the lessons of Latin. There is no hour in education or our children, our youth is sewn with it. Their

Mr. Coveliers, the result is that from an opinion poll published a dozen days ago in various Flemish newspapers it appears that the young people and students who are growing up at the moment assume a rather strong right-wing profile in politics. In fact, that is normal. Remember your youth. We are about the same generation. We also revolted against everything the teacher said. The teacher, the teacher, the almighty, the priest, the imam and the teacher Moral all tell the same thing. The young people start hanging their throats. If you add another five sizes or ten sizes or twenty sizes of that so-called, because it is then still so-called, anti-racism, that will change nothing. It holds them up to the throat. Consequently, we get a healthy response: people who no longer accept that from the teacher’s bench, from the chancellor, from the people’s house or from any parish house, they are dictated what they should think.

Mr. Van den Eynde, have you ever read your own prospectus, your own propaganda sheets, your own sheets of paper that end up in the buses? I start to wonder if you have ever had that in your hands.

Dear colleague, I see that there a lady from Liège applauds, so she has clearly regularly received the pamphlets of the Flemish Bloc in the fiery city in her mailbox; which therefore proves that the poison is everywhere, jusqu'à Liège. Their

Dear Mr. Erdman, if our pamphlets were racist, then we could not only be prosecuted, but then we could also be condemned. You have ensured that, you have ensured that we can every day (...), because you have tried to penalize our position. That is, Mr. Erdman, a damn totalitarian attitude, you know that? Let ideas be punished, you start with it and you end in the dictatorship, what I say, you end in a totalitarian system!

Mr. Van den Eynde, you know that this procedure is not yet over, so we will talk to each other at the moment that the procedure is over! My question was only, whether you, what you spray in the buses, have actually read. I know that you are taking care to bypass the legislation in all possible subtle ways, in order not to be punishable; and you succeed, because indeed, in a genius way you come up with texts that cannot be immediately labeled as racist, but they have a fucking different range than what is taught daily in schools!

undoubtedly . We totally agree on the latter. We really tell the story that politics is completely incorrect. This is not consistent with what is being pushed daily by the pupils’ throat at this moment in every school, to such an extent that they even begin to squeeze. I apologize for the use of the word, Mr. Erdman. Everything comes to an end. One can no longer deal with it at a certain moment if one is systematically confronted with a not very subtle form of brainwashing. I have children who are in high school. They tell me about these books. Anyone who is familiar with secondary education can also tell books about it.

Dear colleague, I repeat that the whole brainwashing, the daily brainwashing, only results in the young people starting to resist it. That is a healthy reaction. I am of that generation who thought that wisdom should not be communicated ex cathedra to the students. I must come to the strange conclusion that all people who have so resisted what was taught ex cathedra have now become specialists in proclaiming dogmas that they not only ex cathedra, but with all the power over which they (...)

Mr. Erdman, you always threaten with the processes. I would like to remind you that they have been working for several years. I think we have been facing this type of processes for more than a decade. If, after ten years, no one has yet been able to condemn anyone, I dare to argue that we should nevertheless invoke the presumption of innocence. Mr. Erdman, you do not give us that presumption of innocence. Your recent words have proven that. You are not only non-democratic in that regard, it is also completely contrary to the legal value that we otherwise so well embody to you.

Durban was a circus, it was a failed spectacle. My party will vote against with a smile on the face and an even healthier smile in the heart.

This resolution was unanimously adopted in the committee and, in my knowledge, unchanged. The discussion is closed. The discussion is close.

De door de commission aangenomen text geldt als basis voor bespreking. (Rgt 66,4) The text adopted by the committee serves as the basis for the discussion. (Rgt 66,4) There will be no amendments in the future. No amendments have been submitted or re-submitted. Voting over the resolution will take place later. The vote on the draft resolution will take place at a later date.

Mr Simonet pointed out in his introduction that the Barcelona Process, which began in November 1995, was a hopeful new beginning for the cooperation between the European Union and the countries of the Mediterranean zone. In this regard, it is therefore important that the Valencia summit, which will take place next week on 22 and 23 April, can evaluate a number of pre-set targets and check whether or not they are realistic.

The draft resolution was amended by a number of colleagues. In submitting the amendments submitted by Mrs. Drion and myself, Mrs. Drion and I said that the praiseful objectives of the draft resolution were not meant to put it on a slope, but that the amendments are meant to supplement the original proposal, which was strongly focused on the economic development of the Mediterranean zone, with a number of additions in the line of requests already formulated by the Chamber in the adoption of resolutions concerning certain countries from those zones. Mr. Moriau of the PS has pointed out that this proposal is called upon because it will provide the government with the opportunity to revive the indispensable process of Barcelona. He also submitted a number of additions through amendments. He also pointed out that it would make sense to include the Balkans in this partnership in the logic of the Mediterranean entity.

The discussion of the amendments also highlighted the fact that both the Chamber and the Senate emphasized the aspect of human rights in the framework of resolutions adopted following the law approving the association agreements with Israel. The association agreements should therefore be evaluated in that sense.

In the discussion of the amendment calling for the addition of negotiations to conclude an association agreement with Palestine simultaneously with the political negotiations that should lead to the recognition of the State of Palestine. It was said that this is an important political signal, but that, although Belgium is in favor, it is difficult to negotiate as long as the state does not exist.

Following the discussion, the amended proposal was adopted with nine votes in favour and one abstinence.

Mr. Speaker, Mr. Minister, dear colleagues, it is in the international climate that we know that the meeting of heads of state and government gathering the countries of the European Union and the 12 partner countries of the Mediterranean Basin will open next week in Valencia. by Mr. Bacquelaine and I wanted the Belgian Parliament to show its support for the Barcelona Process in all its dimensions: economic and financial, political and democratic, but above all social and human. It was indeed on this last point that our Belgian Presidency had more ⁇ insisted in order to ⁇ a number of advances.

One of the difficulties that the Barcelona process encounters is that it is taken hostage by the question of the conflict in the Near and Middle East. The initiative was launched in a perspective of hope, of support for the peace process, and today we are in the opposite situation with the methodical and deliberate destruction of everything that corresponds to the achievements of Oslo and Madrid. One of the consequences of this blockage is that it becomes almost impossible to work usefully with the whole entity "Barcelona" because this Middle East issue makes the work altered by the current context between Israel and the Arab countries. We are back in a blocking situation. Thus, these questions are taken hostage when we need to make progress, either in particular regions of the Mediterranean area or on particular themes.

Our analysis is therefore that the method of the Barcelona process is too heavy, that the strategic challenge must be kept, but that flexibility must also be introduced to address particular topics with some of the participants.

Another difficulty: the EU started with the Barcelona process in a relevant socio-economic hope, but ⁇ a bit utopian, with the creation of a widespread free trade area by the horizon of 2010. This goal is a good lever, but one must question whether the goal can be achieved and whether we have taken the full measure of this challenge. Are the reforms induced by this free and widespread trade in 2010 fully feasible? How can we overcome the socio-political blocks that everyone knows?

Since it is not the governments that can answer this question on their own, we believe that it is necessary to involve all the economic and social actors and to know what are the adjustments of the political system that would make the economic territories of so close countries reactive. We must have the courage to talk about issues of asymmetry, the opening of markets to Mediterranean products, especially agricultural products.

In conclusion, and in our opinion, the Barcelona Process is strategically excellent, but there are initiatives to be taken to rethink its implementation and develop a methodology based on a real situation analysis to take into account the state of the economies, relations between countries and peoples.

A last interesting element is the dialogue of cultures because if there is an element of difference and misunderstanding between the Western world and the Arab-Muslim world, it is in particular on issues concerning women, the status of families, the relationship to individualism.

This is the meaning of the draft resolution submitted by Mr. Bacquelaine and myself, the EU must be able to find a balance between the Institutional Convention, its enlargement process and its various partnerships. Barcelona is undoubtedly the ideal framework for implementing a privileged space of dialogue and cooperation for the Mediterranean basin in order to make progress, this is in any case our goal, human rights, socio-economic development, intercultural dialogue and the creation of a protected environmental framework.

Mr. Speaker, I would like to speak about one point in the resolution on which there is no problem and which the Government especially appreciates. However, point F calls for concrete initiatives for the establishment of the Euro-Mediterranean Development Bank, the principle of which has been applied in the conclusions of the Laeken Declaration. At the European Council in Barcelona, member states agreed to move forward.

A first is planned through a kind of single outlet, within the European Investment Bank, oriented to the southern shore of the Mediterranean. It is not excluded after a number of assessments to go further and possibly move towards the creation of a subsidiary of the European Investment Bank facing the south shore of the Mediterranean. This is the state of the discussion so far. I would like to clarify this at the time of the vote on a resolution: on this point, the state of the debate is at the forefront within the European Investment Bank with the commitment to evaluate, later on, the possible creation of a subsidiary of that same European Investment Bank.

Wouldn’t it be the paragraph G rather than F? Paragraph F relates to Yugoslavia.

Has it changed by intercaling a F? In the text I have, it is paragraph F that is concerned. This is paragraph F of the original proposal.

Mr Minister, I thank you. Are there other interventions? Otherwise I can come to the point that the House, citing all the numbers and all the letters, adopts this resolution on which we will vote soon.

We had discussed this point before and we agreed with the Minister.

The discussion is closed. The discussion is close.

De door de commission aangenomen text geldt als basis voor bespreking. (Rgt 66,4) The text adopted by the committee serves as the basis for the discussion. (Rgt 66,4) There will be no amendments in the future. No amendments have been submitted or re-submitted. Voting over the resolution will take place later. The vote on the draft resolution will take place at a later date.

Mr. Speaker, dear colleagues, we share the concerns of the authors of the resolution on the humanitarian approach to sanctions against Iraq to ensure that the population suffers as little as possible. Our ambassador to the United Nations has made enormous efforts for a new resolution 1382, which is much more selective and deals with the so-called smart sanctions. This resolution will come into force in May of this year and provides for a new sanctions regime allowing all goods to be freely exported to Iraq, with the exception of a special list of products, weapons, military equipment and goods for dual use. Resolution 1284 provides for the temporary lifting of the sanctions if the UN inspectors are again admitted by Saddam Hussein to Iraqi territory. We discredit ourselves when we send this resolution to the world. We do not find this opportune. We must wait for what is happening in Iraq and the goodwill of Saddam Hussein must be tested. Therefore, we will not adopt this resolution.

Mr. Speaker, Mr. Ministers, dear colleagues, I will be short because it is not with speeches that we will alleviate the misery, disease and death of hundreds of thousands of civilian victims in Iraq.

The resolution we are going to vote today is just a step in a long process for greater respect for human rights in this region that has ⁇ been one of the birthplaces of our civilization. Some even go as far as to claim that the earthly paradise was between the Tigris and Euphrates. Others want to turn it into an earthly hell today.

It was in May 1998 for the first time, alerted by overwhelming reports from UNICEF and WHO, that I and my colleague Jean-Jacques Viseur submitted a resolution calling for the lifting of the embargo that affects the Iraqi population. In January 2000, I took the initiative to travel to Baghdad with a delegation from the Belgian Group of the Interparliamentary Union. And whether we are left-handed or right-handed, believers or non-believers, we have all been upset by what we have seen and heard on the spot: the misery and especially that of children. The same message was sent to us in Baghdad by Kofi Annan's delegate on the spot, by the UNICEF coordinator, by religious authorities, by the business officer of several European countries and by some Iraqi authorities including the president of the parliament. by

The message was simple: “Stop the massacre! This is a crime against humanity.” These are the words of Mr. Von Sponeck, Secretary General of the United Nations. by

Returning to Belgium, all those who participated in this trip, Mr. Geert Versnick, Patrick Moriau, Paul Timmermans and myself have co-signed a resolution calling for the end of the embargo. by

At the same time, Professor Marc Bossuyt of Antwerp was reporting to the United Nations Economic and Social Council on the adverse consequences of economic sanctions for the enjoyment of human rights. He took three examples: Burundi, Cuba and Iraq. He concluded — and I quote an interview with Mr. Bossuyt that he gave in "La Libre Belgique" of 10 November 2000 —: "Those who suffer least from the embargo in Iraq, it is the members of the regime that can bypass this weapon against those who use it." by

At the beginning of May 2001, I again submitted a resolution concerning the lifting of the embargo. A few days later, my colleague Daniel Bacquelaine put another on the issue of disarmament in Iraq and the humanitarian situation of its civilian population. The resolution we vote today is the result of a compromise between these two resolutions.

During the discussion in the committee, I proposed two amendments that were adopted unanimously. The first is aimed at limiting, within a specified period of time, the control by the UN of weapons of mass destruction. As you know, this control has already taken place for many years and has not given any results. The press, the media in Belgium have never ⁇ it, except for suspicions of espionage on behalf of America. The second aims to have a Belgian diplomatic representation in Baghdad as more and more EU countries have in order to promote trade between our country and Iraq. It is through economic, cultural and political exchanges that one can recreate a climate more propitious to the pursuit of peace and sustainable development, and it is ⁇ not by isolating Iraq from the rest of the world. by Mr. Pierre Chevalier was able to visit Baghdad a few weeks ago and he was able to see the number of European embassies that are there. by

Whether we address this issue of the embargo or the fact of having a business officer on the ground in Baghdad, we have been answered for 12 years that the moment is not the most appropriate. Over the past 12 years, more than 500,000 children have died due to this murderous embargo. Are we not complicit in genocide? The 500,000 children killed in Iraq is a UNICEF figure, not a figure given by the Iraqi authorities. by

Within a few days of the child rights ceremonies at the UN in New York, can we still accept that small innocent victims are accidentally killed by economic measures that have proven, for 12 years, that they are not reaching their goal? by

Albert Camus said, “True generosity towards the future consists in giving everything to the present.” by

Every day that this embargo continues, it is other children who die, it is other elderly people who die, it is other suffering for mothers and fathers. But ultimately, who benefits from the embargo? by

During the 11 phases of the "petrol for food" program set up since December 1996, Iraqi crude exports totalled, according to Professor Seznek of the Georgetown University of Washington, $52 billion. Of those $52 billion of oil sold by Iraq, only 35% or 18 billion actually benefited Iraq because of the constraints imposed by the UN: the payment of control by UN officials, the war damage in Kuwait and the passing rights of Iraqi oil. Since December 1996, Kuwait has received $10 billion in compensation to which it is entitled, says Professor Seznek. During the same period, Turkey received ⁇ $1 billion in transit duties on Iraqi oil in its territory. by

And who is the main customer of Iraqi oil? I give it in a thousand. The United States is buying 40% of its crude from Iraq. Iraq is the second largest supplier to the U.S. Gulf region after Saudi Arabia and well ahead of Kuwait. by

Another major beneficiary of this embargo are the major banks located in New York and to whom Iraq must pay in advance all that it buys as part of the "oil for food" operation. Do you believe that all these beneficiaries really care about the fate of Iraq’s children? by

By voting this resolution, we are taking a small step in the right direction, which is indicated by the UN Subcommittee on Human Rights, in particular in its resolution 2001/115 of 16 August 2001 and which stated that the current regime of sanctions is no longer acceptable due to the cumulative effect of sanctions over a long period of time. by

Of course, the political system in Baghdad is ⁇ not a paradise regime and we must also strive, in dialogue and not through war, that all civil and political, economic and social rights are respected on the entire Iraqi territory including in the Kurdish provinces. This will not be achieved through a new foundation of violence. "We don't shoot on ambulances," says a fashionable slogan, so think of the 500,000 children in Iraq.

Mr. Speaker, Mr. Speaker, Mr. Speaker, Mr. Speaker, Mr. Speaker, Mr. Speaker, Mr. Speaker, Mr. Speaker, Mr. Speaker, Mr. Speaker, Mr. Speaker, Mr. Speaker, Mr. Speaker. Lefevre about Iraq. The draft resolution that we are called to vote today comprises two dimensions: on the one hand, the future of Iraq, its responsibilities and its independence within the international community, and on the other hand, the concerns we all share about the fate and suffering of the civilian population. With these different criteria in mind, we have proposed this resolution. As mentioned by Mr. Lefevre, a synthesis work was carried out in relation to two proposals that had been initially submitted.

The purpose of this text is precisely to remind us of our desire that a political and diplomatic logic prevails over a purely military approach. In other words, we want the government to support, at the time of the vote on the Security Council resolution, which must take place before 31 May, the lifting of the embargo on civilian goods, the strengthening of controls on dual goods, and demands the unconditional return of disarmament inspectors. If Iraq does not comply with the demands made by the Security Council, other means may have to be used with consequences for the entire region that are obviously difficult to evaluate.

Following the Gulf War, the UN Security Council, in its resolution 687, resumed Iraq’s disarmament obligations: no construction, no use, no acquisition, no development of weapons of mass destruction, and no possession of missiles with a range of more than 150 kilometers. by

The controls imposed on Iraq were binding, but they were deemed necessary and legitimate because Iraq had failed to meet its international commitments for the most dangerous and destabilizing weapons categories. The international community cannot make the economy of returning the inspectors to the ground to put an end to its concerns: what is happening in Iraq for now forty months? What is the state of the Iraqi regime’s biological and chemical programs? It is not time to close your eyes or close an incomplete file. by

The international community cannot pretend to want to impose a 100% effective disarmament regime, but it must be able to find a balance between a high degree of technical confidence in a verification process and a high degree of political confidence through a clear and unambiguous commitment from Iraq.

We must move from a policy of sanctions to a policy of future-oriented international vigilance and control, to a policy where sanctions must strictly focus on prohibited weapons and their means of production and no longer hit the civilian population. At the time when we are advocating for the lifting of an embargo on material goods intended for the civilian population, we must be careful to maintain some coherence as others would like to take economic sanctions against Israel in the context of the current conflict in the Middle East. If a logic is followed within the framework of Iraq, I think we should stick to it. Any embargo affecting civilian populations shall be subject to restrictions in its scope. by

Iraq is allowed to export an unlimited amount of oil and import a wide range of goods to meet the humanitarian needs of its population and to restore its infrastructure. Increased income is theoretically available for the implementation of the program provided by Resolution 986. The Iraqi government should be partially able to reduce malnutrition and improve the health of its people.

It should be recalled that the Iraqi authorities have some responsibility with regard to the disastrous state in which their country is in, especially since they do not fully use the resources provided by the oil program for food. by

Despite its shortcomings, this program continues to make a significant difference in the daily life of the population, especially in the agriculture, health and housing sectors. While the nutritional status of Iraqis has improved statistically since March 1997, it remains below the UN minimum. The same applies to the health situation, which ⁇ improved, but which remains extremely precarious. The current fundamental problem remains also the delays in the procurement by the Iraqi government and therefore the use of the available funds. by

I insist that the quality of Iraqi infrastructure, refrigeration facilities, mills and silos, pharmaceutical factories, water treatment plants, schools, will be a real problem when lifting the embargo on civilian property. Indeed, the Iraqi government will then have great difficulties in finding sufficient liquidity for the renovation of its infrastructure.

In conclusion, we believe that it is necessary: 1. to maintain the embargo on all types of weapons; 2. demand the return of the inspectors on the ground and the full cooperation of the Iraqi authorities, close the files that must be so and establish the control regime; 3. promptly study ways to lower the level of all types of arms in the Middle East, and implement confidence and transparency measures to reduce high-tech arms transfers in the region; remove the embargo on civilian goods and international commercial transport, enable the rearrangement of the means of transport for the delivery of aid, enable the gradual economic resumption, think about methods of investment in public services and ensure, through an international distribution system, that all regions of the country receive appropriate humanitarian aid; Maintain and strengthen controls on Iraqi crude exports and allow, under control, modernization of oil facilities so that the outcome of such exports, passing through the UN account, benefits directly to the Iraqi population. by

This is, dear colleagues, the meaning and content of the resolution that is proposed to you.

Mr. Speaker, colleagues, I will not repeat the entire speech of Mr. Bacquelaine on 20.04 but I have signed the motion for the same reason as he. I would like to highlight one aspect concerning Northern Iraq, namely Kurdistan. We recently went to Kurdistan with a few people. We had contact there with Barzani and Talabani, who govern a more or less autonomous republic there. Despite the isolation of these two republics, we could see that things like traffic infrastructure, education and hospitals work pretty well. Therefore, despite everything, a state is possible. Even on a purely democratic level, republics function properly. There is a very high tolerance towards the Christian minority. We talked with bishops from the area. There is also a very high tolerance towards the Turkmen. What the Kurds suffer in Turkey, they do not do to the Turkmen minority. I find that very striking. There is also an opposition press. We have seen party rooms of the opposition parties. Everything is democratically speaking not cake and egg, far from. It is the beginning of a democratic society where there is still much to learn, but which is still a little more valuable than in the surrounding countries.

Therefore, it is our position that removing the no-fly zones to northern Iraq — as originally stated in the text — would destroy this embryo, this small democratic plant that is growing. That is why we submitted an amendment supported by Agalev, the SP.A and the Flemish Bloc. I am pleased that the nofly zones are being challenged, that they are subject to approval by the international community, the UN, and that they are only allowed to last as long as Baghdad is not willing to give northern Iraq the security it needs. Therefore, I am very pleased with this resolution and the important correction in it for the Kurds.

Mr. Speaker, I ask the Minister of Foreign Affairs to confirm that the Belgian Government may, of course, accept the humanitarian considerations that are at the basis of the draft resolution, but that it would nevertheless like to make some comments on certain recommendations as well as on the substance of the problem.

First, the Belgian government is in favor of any measures aimed at improving the humanitarian situation in Iraq, which remains deplorable in certain sectors, such as public health.

He has repeatedly regretted the extension of the economic embargo, which also penalizes the Iraqi civilian population. Belgium is therefore in favor of a new, more targeted approach to sanctions, affecting the regime rather than the population. With regard to Iraq, it seems more important, as proposed in the draft resolution, to establish effective controls aimed at preventing rearmament rather than completely isolating the country. Security Council Resolution 1382 of November 22 goes in this direction. by

It is expected that in May of this year, a resolution of the Security Council inaugurates a new sanctions regime that provides that all goods can be freely exported to Iraq, except those that will appear on a new specific list. This list will include military equipment and dual-use goods, civilian and military. by

It is, however, equally important not to lose sight of the objective contained in Security Council resolution 1284 which provides for the suspension of sanctions in the event of Iraq's re-establishment of cooperation with UN inspections, the ultimate objective remaining in the longer term the definitive lifting of sanctions is Iraq's full reintegration into the international community.

In this context, it seems difficult to advocate unilaterally for the unilateral lifting of the economic embargo. It cannot be abstained from international obligations and from the broader framework of the negotiations already undertaken in New York, nor from the strict observance of the UN resolutions which provide, in particular, for the return of inspectors to Iraq.

Furthermore, I would like to recall that Belgium, as it is not a member of the Security Council, can only play a limited role in this matter.

Then, some requests to the government reiterated, for example, under point 4 of the resolution may not sufficiently take into account the realities prevailing in Iraq, where the existing racist regime has ⁇ not waited for the imposition of an economic embargo to kill in the egg any veil of opposition, while at the same time disregarding the most basic human rights.

The status of women in Iraq also raises questions similar to those raised elsewhere in the region. In this context, implementing the recommendation to encourage internal political dialogue in Iraq with a view to the democratization of the political regime is a task at least of the most complex.

As for the Belgian diplomatic representation in Baghdad, I can confirm that it is gradually moving from our embassy in Aman. Our competent diplomatic representative for Iraq and the trade attached designated by the Walloon Region organize their presence in Baghdad in order to be there more regularly and longer. The resumption of cooperation between the United Nations and Iraq would undoubtedly allow to quickly take another step in the restoration of a full Belgian diplomatic representation in Baghdad.

Here, Mr. Speaker, are the few comments I would like to make on behalf of the Minister of Foreign Affairs.

Mr. Speaker, I would like to provide a simple information, which I would like to insist on. It is said that the entry of dual-use products into Iraq is prohibited. You know that now, in Iraq, you can’t bring children’s pencil to schools because in the pencil there is graphite. And it is the United Nations, in New York, that prevents these pens from entering Iraqi territory. The concept of a dual-use product should also be understood.

Dear colleagues, I would like to point out to the House that the resolution, which was signed by Jacques Lefèvre, Daniel Bacquelaine, Raymond Langendries, Patrick Moriau, Paul Timmermans and Dirk Van der Maelen, was studied in a committee before yesterday and that the House was willing to give it the priority to include it on our agenda today.

The discussion is closed. The discussion is close.

De door de commission aangenomen text geldt als basis voor bespreking. (Rgt 66,4) The text adopted by the committee serves as the basis for the discussion. (Rgt 66,4) There will be no amendments in the future. No amendments have been submitted or re-submitted. Voting over the resolution will take place later. The vote on the draft resolution will take place at a later date.

Mr. Speaker, I planned a short report because this matter is so important and has triggered so many interventions in the ongoing analysis of the project in committee that I think our colleagues will continue to intervene long today. However, I think it would be good to advise our colleagues to read this report. We have had the opportunity to openly discuss matters that are at stake in those of democracy. I recommend it to everyone. I have drawn up the essential points in a spirit of synthesis and I will therefore ask my colleagues, whose interventions I would not have taken back, not to be rigorous. This will save time for everyone.

In his speech, the Minister recalls that this bill essentially deals with the transposition of elements concerning the status of members of the staff of the police services. These measures are currently provided under the Royal Decree of 30 March 2001, commonly referred to as the "Mammouth" Decree. This bill was nicknamed "Exodus" as what, at Minister Duquesne, is done in the grandiose and poetic from time to time.

This project includes essential elements such as the enumeration of grades, the general conditions of recruitment, the appointing authority, the career structure, the rights and duties, the basic rules of evaluation, the modalities of exercise of mandated functions and their remuneration, the basic rules of evaluation, the modalities of exercise of functions, the rules relating to definitive withdrawal from employment and termination of functions, the right to medical care, the right to treatment and guaranteed remuneration. In doing so, the draft is intended to comply with Article 184 of the Constitution, which gives only the legislature the power to organize the allocation of police services as well as to determine the essential elements of the status of its staff. The draft also amends certain provisions of the law of 7 December 1998 organising an integrated police service, structured on two levels. These include some technical changes, but also changes to the role of mayors and chairs of police colleges in the selection and evaluation of local police personnel.

Finally, this bill establishes the legal basis for the existence, the principles of operation and the composition of district information crossings and communication centers. These decentralized services of the federal police are essential elements of the actual integration of the two levels of police. That’s why it’s really good that a law formalizes the principles of collaboration between federal and local levels. Two bills from CD&V were attached to the bill. One deals with incompatibilities dedicating the inability to sit in the police council, the other of the integration and status of the single guard.

The general discussion focused on topics as diverse as the financial impact of the measures envisaged in the project or the impact of these measures on the operational, motivational and efficient police services. Since the members of the Interior Committee were ⁇ active and productive during the analysis of this project, I saw myself in the obligation to conduct a selection and to engage in a synthesis exercise because the content of the debates was rich and varied.

The budgetary impact of the reform, both on the federal budget and on the municipal budgets, was at the heart of the concerns of the majority of speakers. This committee had the particular thing that the concerns seemed common to all political groups. The topics that were addressed are as follows: - The modalities of transfer or assignment of the buildings of the territorial brigades of gendarmerie to the local police zones. The specificity of the areas having a prison or a courthouse on their territory and the obligations arising in terms of personnel. In this context, several speakers asked the minister about the effective establishment of a security body that could take care, in particular, of the transfer of prisoners. - The mechanism of the remuneration of the federal police when it assists the local police has been discussed by many stakeholders as well as the reciprocity of the system when, on the contrary, the local police is recruited for federal tasks. - The methods for calculating the eligible surplus cost for which many municipalities are currently in expectation because they are concerned about seeing the actual impact on their municipal finances. The status of police auxiliaries and calog personnel.

Beyond strictly budgetary aspects, certain measures or options have also been dealt with according to their impact on operational efficiency, on the efficiency of the areas but also on the motivation of the police services personnel: - The status of the head of the area of categories 1 and 2 and the accessibility for them to the rank of division commissioner, as provided in the Mammouth Decree. Many members of the committee emphasize the need for equal status between the heads of zone. They want the difficulty of setting up a police zone to be recognized and effectively entitles to a promotion after three years of office and a positive evaluation at mid-term. Thus, they will really be on an equal footing compared to all other area heads. The immediate appointment of the average officers who have successfully obtained their officer patents raises fears of seeing some form of exodus from the local police elite for the benefit of the federal police. - The difficulties for certain urban areas to cope with urban violence and the need to increase the staff framework in some ⁇ exposed areas. It will need to be seen whether it is appropriate to apply for these areas for federal missions. - The specificity of the female staff of the police services during pregnancy and breastfeeding was also addressed with the expression of a desire to see positive discriminatory measures in the law so as to ensure that these persons can benefit from their sick leave without losing status. This is in order to see the police bodies become a little more feminine. - I will conclude with one of the most important aspects of this project and which caught the attention of the members of the committee. This is the collaboration of local police zones within the district information centers – CIA. The importance of this body lies in the fact that it is a key factor in a genuine integration of police services. Concerns are expressed as to the actual capacity of certain areas to meet functionality requirements in terms of staff, and questions are also raised as to the type of participation required by the areas: is it only personnel or will it be participating in the equipment of these information centers? What are the criteria used to determine the needs? There is great concern about the permanent amputation of the personnel that will be allocated to the proper functioning of these centers. The discussion on this topic was very rich and open. by Mr. The Minister gave very positive answers and an amendment was submitted in order to meet the concerns of a number of people regarding the small areas.

Like the point I have just developed, the whole general discussion took place in a very open manner with circumstantiated and very comprehensive answers from the Minister; many points mentioned received direct answers and were not the subject of amendments. Many amendments were submitted by members of both the majority and the opposition and were approved.

As for the two bills submitted by CD&V, they were not accepted.

This concludes my report, Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Speaker, Mr. Minister, Colleagues, the Government, with the present draft, meets the demands that we made at the time in the amendment of Article 184 of the Constitution. On the one hand, it is a good thing that ultimately the essential parts of the statute of the members of the municipal police are fixed in the law. This gives employees security and protection. On the other hand, we continue to emphasize that the intersection of the procedures relating to the Mammouth Decision, which are currently pending at the State Council, is unworthy of a rule of law. Their

The CD&V can of course be found in a number of other amendments to the law on the integrated police. The change of the bloodline of the third to the second degree for the members of the police council, the restrictions on Article 238 of the Integrated Police Act concerning the leave before retirement and the regime for the sole field guards are changes that correctly address the problems that arise now, with the entry into force of the Integrated Police. Their

However, some problems remain unresolved. They would be better now, when dealing with this design, to be arranged. First of all, I think of the medical protection of the members of the police service. The government continues to stick to the list of recruited doctors, despite the growing protest of the industry. This protest is justified. There is no objective reason to maintain this system of recruited physicians and not to authorise all recruited physicians to provide free medical care to the members of the operational framework. Our group is therefore proposing an amendment on this subject. Their

Mr. Speaker, colleagues, our group has mixed feelings about this draft. The legal arrangement of the statute is one thing, but it is unacceptable that this draft again transfers some of the costs of the reform to the local authorities. The government announced at the end of November 2001 that it would make a number of amendments to the Mammoth Decision. All this leads to a significant increase in the costs of police reform. It would be negotiated with the trade unions to save about 800 million. At the same time, the evaluations of the zones should provide a solution to the additional costs of police reform. These additional costs put the municipalities in a financial wreck. Negotiations with the trade unions, however, are ongoing and the various protocol agreements are repeatedly rejected. The evaluation of the zones and filling out the acceptable additional costs goes the same way, but the minister just goes on. He can hardly do otherwise. Minister Vande Lanotte has fixed the margin of negotiation, Minister Duquesne executes and the municipalities pay the fee. In a very subtle way, one cost after another is transferred to the local authorities. The uncertainty among local governments is therefore increasing sharply, in particular as no reassuring signal is given from this government with regard to the expenditure which they have had to cover for the acceptable additional costs. The budget control for the Easter holiday would have been an ideal moment for a reassuring signal, but even then the government refused to look ahead and no additional amount was planned. Their

Not only the financial uncertainty weighs heavily on the municipalities. Also the loss of capacity, caused by the new statute on the one hand and the ever-increasing tasks for the local police on the other, simply becomes an unsustainable situation. I know that Brice De Ruyver claims that there is no loss of capacity at all, but such statements can, in my opinion, only come from people who have absolutely no sense of what is happening at the local level. Mr De Ruyver gives as an example the training programs. Recruitment is completely lacking. In addition, the Minister also imposes restrictions on the mobility of staff. The system of the federal pot ensures that the zones from Limburg get people from West Flanders allocated. They, of course, demand a relocation in the context of mobility as soon as possible. This system should be revised as soon as possible. Colleagues, there is therefore indeed a loss of capacity and this is once again provided by this exodus law. The zones should also contribute to the crew of the communications and information centers. They may do so by providing staff or providing a financial contribution. In order to regulate this intervention, this law grants the authority to the King. Granting such a carte blanche to the King is completely unacceptable. Moreover, the draft article 96bis is completely contrary to the spirit of article 96 of the law on the integrated police. In the explanatory memo, it is clear that the support of the local police to the federal services is made through dispatch and that the federal government will refund their bets to the zones. This law, Mr. Minister, puts this on the burden of the municipalities, in addition to the other additional costs. Our group is therefore proposing an amendment in this sense. If the members of the majority have any feelings about the events at the municipal level, they will support the amendment.

Mr Vanpoucke, you have defended an amendment introducing an article 87bis (new), as well as your amendment to article 109, which you submitted together with Mr Tant, and your amendment to article 129. You can subsequently intervene in the article-by-article discussion.

Mr. Speaker, Mr. Minister, dear colleagues, the text that is submitted to us today is nothing more than a legal confirmation of the essential elements of a royal decree deliberated in Council of Ministers. by

By depositing this text on our pupitres, the government, and more ⁇ the Minister of the Interior, respects the provisions of Article 184 of the Constitution, which requires that the essential elements of the status of members of the staff of the two-level integrated police be regulated by law. In 2001, however, the constituent gave the Government the possibility to regulate the status of staff members of the two-level integrated police services by royal decree, provided that the essential elements of that status are confirmed by law before 30 April 2002. This is precisely the very essence of the bill: to comply with a constitutional obligation. The House of Representatives will take its responsibilities. by

Certainly, a series of provisions of the Royal Decree "Mammouth" must be renegotiated in order to result in effective operational and police presence on the ground. Some of us, as local representatives, are also facing the perverse effects of certain provisions of the Statute. Perverse effects that could not always be foreseen when drawing up this monumental decree but which, however, require an urgent solution for the well-being of our fellow citizens. A quick solution must be found, but ⁇ not in precipitation. The "Mammouth" is a text that has been the subject of laborious trade union negotiations that have resulted in a good overall fair and balanced outcome. by

For the MR group, it was therefore out of question to make amendments to this text that could disrupt the overall economy. by

What matters at this time is to lay the essential foundations of the Statute before 30 April 2002, or to make more punctual changes later, in collaboration, of course, with trade union organisations, in order to be able to correctly assess the impact of one or another proposed change. In this regard, I would like to thank our Minister of the Interior who once again responded in a circumstantial manner to the observations raised by the colleagues of the Committee of the Interior and myself. Some points really deserved to be stopped a little so as to correctly grasp their scope. by

Allow me again to emphasize the constructive attitude of the Interior Minister who has not left any door closed to debate, whether with the majority or with the opposition. The arguments of one and the other have been taken into account to their just value. The Minister has also undertaken to consult the trade union organizations on various points raised during the examination of this text in committee.

The MR group would also like to thank the Minister of the Interior for being sensitive to the arguments made and the proposals made in order to find a fair solution to the problem of local police chief officers holding the rank of police commissioner. The heads of mandatory bodies of categories 1 and 2 appointed in the framework of the first nominations are, in the same way as the other mandatory bodies, the craftsmen and pioneers of the reform of the police services. They are, like the other mandators, responsible for the effective integration and implementation of the reform on the ground. by

The position held in the committee therefore seems consistent to us because all mandatory officers, both federal and local, have undergone similar selection procedures. Both federal and local, the required profile of the position was the same regardless of the category of the mandate. Many of the mandates of categories 1 and 2 are also exercised by persons who have been incorporated into the rank of Division Commissioner of Police. The heads of bodies of categories 1 and 2 shall perform the same work as their colleagues who have been selected in the same manner but are remunerated according to their grade. by

There are also areas in which the heads of mandatory bodies of categories 1 and 2 with the grade of Commissioner assume important responsibilities but are lower in grade and treatment than some of their collaborators. This situation is unfair and risks dismotivating the head of small areas. As some colleagues have pointed out, the qualities a area manager must demonstrate are not fundamentally different whether he operates in a small area or in a large area. Furthermore, one could also question the absence, at the end of the performance of the first term by a chief commissioner of a mandated body of category 1 or 2, of promotion to the grade of division commissioner. No valuation was planned for the authorized police officer of category 1 and 2 who had successfully completed his task. The solution developed during this committee debate seems to us to be more equitable and is capable of encouraging the heads of bodies of categories 1 and 2 designated in the framework of the first nominations to fully invest in the implementation of our reform. by

From now on, the Commissioner appointed in the framework of the primary nominations to a position of Head of Corps of Category 1 and 2 will also be promoted to the rank of Police Division Commissioner if, at the end of the third year of the exercise of the mandate, he has not been subjected to a negative assessment. by

The MR group believes that the text we are about to vote today is a balanced text, which has obtained a broad consensus within the Interior Committee. It is true that on some points of the statute, solutions still need to be developed. During these discussions in the committee, difficulties were of course raised, solutions were discussed. Some of them won the agreement of the Minister of the Interior, who committed to consulting the trade union organizations. by

The discussions were serene and constructive. Everyone took their responsibilities and did not harm the overall economy of the text that had been the subject of arduous trade union negotiations. by

Please know, Mr. Minister, that for the various reasons I have just mentioned, the MR group will support the text that is proposed to us today.

Mr. Speaker, Mr. Minister, colleagues, already at the discussion of the octopus agreement in 1998 it was agreed that the reform of the police services could only succeed if the different statutes were coordinated. Four years later, it is here. I am not saying that the government has stopped. In June 2000 an agreement was concluded with the representative trade unions on the unity status of police personnel. On 30 March 2001, the Mammoth Decree was published. The same month, Article 184 of the Constitution was amended. Finally, the legal status is now also defined in a separate law, and that on the advice of the Council of State.

Can we talk about a success story? The unity statute was criticized for its high budgetary costs and the loss of employability. In the meantime, however, we note that the government is doing everything possible to reduce the additional costs for the municipalities. Unfortunately, the past cannot be simply erased. The Protocol Agreement of 25 January provides the possibility to strengthen certain aspects of the statute — such as night and weekend services, telephone charges, the limitation of permitted days of absence without medical certificate, the non-indexation of allowances and the fees until 31 December 2003 — which is positive for both the financial and operational aspects of the reform.

Mr. Minister, that all happened, of course, without affecting what was agreed by the commission. Some have criticized the agreement. It is obvious that no agreement is perfect for all parties. Mr. Vanpoucke, one can continue to demand the staff the lowest out of the can and then remain on his portfolio at the moment when one must bear the financial consequences of this. This is largely the philosophy that has been followed from the opposition in recent months.

The committee’s work has, as colleague De Permentier rightly said, been conducted in a rather positive atmosphere. This has allowed us to improve and refine a number of points after a fruitful discussion, including Article 33.

Article 33 of the draft law raised fundamental concerns. It somewhat rebelled against the royal decrees of hiring the zone chiefs, the judicial directors or dirjus, and the director coordinators or 'dirco's. Both the commissars of the municipal police and, for example, the brigade commanders of the national guard could, like other senior officers, apply for a prime appointment. Eventually, many ordinary commissars and brigade commanders passed the selection and assessment tests. The zone leaders prove at the moment that they can contribute to the reform on the ground. However, in the spirit of Article 33, that category would not have been promoted to the position of Chief Commissioner, which is an unacceptable discrimination. The amendment, which was approved with the consent of the Minister in the committee, is addressing this gap.

Specifically, current zone heads — who are appointed in accordance with the mobility rules established by the King for the vacant position of senior officer — will also be eligible for promotion to the rank of chief commissioner in the new career scheme, in so far as that would not already be the case. Furthermore, the requirement that the relevant zone head of a police zone of at least category 3 — with a minimum of 150 staff members — must be ignored. After all, there is no reason to believe that a reform in a smaller police zone will automatically go smoother than in a larger one. The qualities a zone manager must possess do not fundamentally differ from those of a zone manager in a larger zone. The only condition now is that the zone chief has completed at least three years of his mandate and has not received a negative evaluation.

Mr. Minister, I am convinced that this arrangement will motivate the people on the ground, and in particular the zone leaders, to carry out the difficult task of police reform.

Other concerns in the committee concerned, among other things, the fact that, especially in smaller police zones, one would have trouble with the mandatory contribution to the functioning of the district information intersections or AIKs. This is a too unilateral approach. If the AIKs are transformed into real information intersection points, the outflow is proportional to the inflow. However, this requires at least a commitment of all 196 police zones and of the federal police.

A study on the burden of Home Affairs has also calculated that the impact on local capacity will always be lower than the 2% standard. Can you confirm this in the plenary session? Can you explain more about this study? There was no opportunity for this in the committee.

The distress from the zones is driven by the fear that they will be charged with numerous federal tasks in addition to the basic police care. The transport of detainees and the surveillance of courts work continuously as a disturbance transmitter. This has been repeatedly expressed during the discussion of the bill in the committee. We therefore call on the Government to remove all remaining obstacles as soon as possible. We address our call not only to Domestic Affairs and Justice, but equally to Land Defense. After all, from that department must come the people who will take over the transport of prisoners.

One of the last articles of the draft law provides for a budget item allowing the international bodies and local authorities to be charged with benefits for activities carried out outside the statutory tasks of the police. This is not so unusual. This already exists, for example, for the accompaniment of value transfers. Mr. Minister, in the near future it will need to be considered whether the local police can also charge performance for tasks that do not strictly belong to its legal tasks. Will it be possible in the future to charge performance to the organizers for the deployment of additional police at, for example, breeders, music festivals or football matches? Or should the zonal solidarity between the corpses apply in the event of regional or cross-communal manifestations?

Mr. Minister, I conclude with the observation that the VLD remains vigilant as to the budgetary impact of the police reform on the municipal budgets. The signals we have received over the last few weeks are rather reassuring. In addition to the agreements previously concluded — on 6 March 2001 and 21 November 2001 — the Government, together with the representatives of the cities and municipalities in a separate supervisory committee, will examine the additional costs remaining and the extent to which the federal government may intervene.

Mr Cortois, Mr Tant wishes to interrupt your speech.

Mr. Cortois, if I am well informed, that mixed working group has already met on Monday, but it has not yet been reached. This is because although the government promises in principle to bear the additional costs, but the mayors keep their portfolios closed. This is not beautiful, as you have already said. However, they know that certain expenses must be borne by them.

Mr Cortois, you are right in the extent that it is about the financial consequences resulting from decisions that would have been taken by the mayors, by the municipal councils, or by the police councils themselves. But when it comes to financial consequences arising from a decision by the Minister and Parliament, it makes sense that the federal government bears those costs. You should not blame us for reminding the government of its promise that it would bear the additional costs. The government nuances that promise by saying that it is only about the additional costs on which the federal government is based. I can agree with that. However, I cannot accept that one would come to the ridiculous conclusion that it is not more than 15% of the actual additional costs.

Mr. Cortois, despite your beautiful words, you will thus put many municipalities in a situation where they are allowed to delete their investment plans. You are complicit in this. I warn you about this. We will continue to repeat this accusation. I hope that some who have proven in the past that they are right about the autonomy, including financial autonomy, of our municipalities with us will remind the government of its promise. I now look at the other side of the hall, but I do not record much animo there, except ⁇ with Mr. Eerdekens, who seems to find my presentation ⁇ pleasant, unless he laughs for another reason.

In any case, Mr. Cortois, we will remind the government of its promise. I hope you will be on our side.

Mr. Tante, it may happen from time to time that I will be on your side, but I can tell you now that it will not be so often.

Mr. Tant, we are not going to repeat the discussion in the committee — which you, as chairman, have, by the way, led brilliantly. The Government has committed to bear the normal, responsible, additional costs that a police reform entails. The VLD is also of the opinion that the federal government should be held accountable for the decisions it has made itself. This is, of course, something different from what I establish in many municipalities that have been led by the CVP for years, sometimes for 40 years or more. I have found that many of these municipalities have failed to make efforts for the safety of citizens in all those years, despite the changing society. It is not because one has invested too little for years and made too little effort for security that one may resort to the police reform to express criticism. I’m not saying that this is the case everywhere, but so are many municipalities.

When one compares the budgets of the different municipalities of our country, one finds that the share of the police fluctuates between 5% and 12% of the municipal budget. It is evident that in rural municipalities at that time one or two field guards or at best three field guards were limited, and that in fact there was no municipal police corps, but we now live in other times. Both in the south of the country and in certain parts of the north of the country, in the past, security had to be applied to the National Guard or to the permanent police posts in the large and medium-sized cities.

When one wants to tell the story of the police reform, one must judge them on its objective additional costs, including the costs of changing the statute. I also make some reservation to the statute, but certain political pamphlets from CD&V Burgemeesters — I mention that no policy statements anymore — have nothing to do with security or with the care therefore Mr. Tant, despite your, admitted, large knowledge on this subject, you must admit that this is only about party politics and that I regret.

Mr. Cortois, I do not want to descend to the local level. I have no intention of judging the policies of college-building masters, anywhere.

I too not.

Mr. Cortois, the less pleasant characteristics you describe are found everywhere. Let us admit that.

You say that part of the explanation lies with the efforts that some have done and others have not done. This is largely incorrect. On the contrary, to hear the reactions of mayors who have made a serious effort, also in the past, in terms of police care, they feel a contrario even more caught than the others. In the evaluation we will see who is right, but I am the interpreter of many colleagues who assure me that they have already made great efforts in the past. However, they now feel more caught than the others.

Mr. Cortois, let us be concrete. We agree on the principle that the additional costs, in so far as they arise from decisions taken over the heads of municipalities, must be borne by the federal government. Then you can’t agree that the federal government, in proportion, charges 10%, 15% or 20%? That would be a laugh. Are we agreed on this?

Mr. Tante, we agree on this. If we follow that approach, we must indeed go to see municipality by municipality, or police zone by police zone, what efforts have taken place and what their consequences are. At least we agree on this. Furthermore, we can both be right, if that can reassure us, and we must essentially wait for what the evaluation will bring in this regard.

I am pleased to note that the government has helped the municipalities by accelerating the evaluation of the police reform.

Mr Cortois, your speech just ended with the criticism of mayors of a particular direction. I think it was not relevant. It is not good at this occasion to criticize the too limited efforts that small municipalities would have made in the past in terms of security. In the past, this belonged merely to municipal autonomy. It was up to each municipality to decide what effort they wanted to deliver. When we do scale enlargement, we must ensure that the effort is used in equal proportions. And there is exactly the shoe, but not in the sense as you claimed, if I am at least well informed.

I conclude my speech.

In any case, the draft law plays an important role for the staff. Employment security has been created. The police have a statute. This is a huge step forward compared to the situation in which various corps were located. This is undoubtedly a positive element for the further success of the police reform.

Mr. Minister, you have to walk a very difficult path. The major strength lines of police reform are not set by you. They were expelled by a vast majority of members of Parliament. I therefore think that it is the task of the members of the Parliament – whatever party they belong to, Mr. Tant – to assist you in bringing the police reform to a good end. Mr. Minister, regarding the VLD, you enjoy our full confidence.

Although I have already expressed some concerns, I would like to comment on a few points.

First of all, I would like to emphasize the quality of the debates that took place within the Interior Committee. It was interesting to be able to discuss freely all those subjects that come back repeatedly in committees but about which we never really went to the bottom of the debate. by

There is indeed a concern in relation to both the federal and municipal financial aspect. The financial aspect is important at the municipal level. The municipalities should invest in their police services while they could ⁇ do so in infrastructure, for example. We all know that local elected people prefer to invest where the population sees the effects directly rather than in a matter that doesn’t really interest them except when there are security issues.

We insisted on giving local areas the opportunity to function properly because, under this functioning, there is obviously an important democratic issue. We all said, at one point or another, that this reform had to succeed because nobody wanted to see the spectre of the single police. Mr. Minister, you have expressed yourself very regularly on this subject during numerous interpellations; you have specified that this was not the goal. by

The government and you yourself have put a whole series of things in place to help both areas and municipalities that are very concerned. The decisions that have been made and the measures to analyze the eligible surplus cost for which we have not yet received all the answers are interesting directions. But you have also taken other courageous steps. To re-engage a trade union negotiation to ⁇ savings was a risk. This kind of initiative should be welcomed. However, it is not only at the level of statutes and wages that you can save; it is also at the level of exchanges and collaboration that you can set up between the federal police and the local police. by

This famous ability to mortgage local areas is often addressed. There also the financial aspect is important because everyone knows that some of the aid that the federal police will bring to the local level will be reimbursed. Mr. Minister, you say that the federal tasks that will be fulfilled by the local police will be taken into account as part of the federal allocation. I am very pleased to see inserted within this law the desire to translate, by a royal decree, the taking into account of the tasks performed by the local police. This is a form of reciprocity that has been established.

Another interesting point is the agreements that have been reached regarding taking into account the specific status of female staff. When a policewoman is pregnant, she encounters real difficulties by losing all her rights and her ability to get sick. Today, Mr. Minister, you have agreed to include this specific situation in the law. Although it is symbolic, it is indeed a very important signal.

Finally, the establishment of district communication centers is also of paramount importance. We have just laid down the legal bases, but there is still a long job to do since the enforcement orders must be drawn up. In fact, we decided to allow some areas to participate not in terms of personnel but financially. However, there is a danger. It is absolutely necessary to ensure that as many local areas as possible participate in these information centers because this is how we will really have a two-level integrated police. Everything must be done so that the areas participate jointly with the federal police. Management of information and communication is a major issue. Mr. Minister, you said you would be careful. We will also be.

Mr. Speaker, my speech will be brief because it is unnecessary to repeat long but very rich and very constructive debates that took place in committees and which are ⁇ with great precision in the excellent report of Mrs. Pelzer-Salandra. Initially, it was only the transposition — which explains the word "exodus" that was chosen by my collaborators — of a number of provisions of the so-called "mammouth" decree into a law. Article 184 of the Constitution states that police services are not services of ordinary officials but affect the functioning of democracy itself. It was therefore justified that the essential provisions should be enacted by a law and not only in a royal decree, even deliberated in Council of Ministers. These essential provisions relate to the enumeration of grades, the general conditions of recruitment, the appointing authority, the career structure, rights and duties, the basic rules of assessment, the modalities for the exercise of mandated functions and their remuneration, the rules on definitive withdrawal from employment and termination of functions, the right to medical care, the right to guaranteed treatment and remuneration. These are essential provisions and therefore there is no risk of arbitrariness in the head of the executive power. This is an additional guarantee of the democratic functioning of the police services. by

On this occasion, it was appropriate to give a number of clarifications and explanations after a trade union negotiation procedure that extended over several months. The "mammouth" decree contains more than 1,700 articles and has itself been the subject of a ministerial execution decree called "dinosaur" which also contains several hundred articles. The discussion allowed to provide clarifications that will be very useful to all those who will have to practice this new regulatory device.

The government has taken advantage of this to improve a number of provisions on the technical level. This is why we wanted to improve the provisions of the law of 7 December 1988 regarding the processing of police information. To this subject, the text of the project devotes the existence of the crossroads of information of the district which is very important, specifies its missions and the principles of its composition. The rules concerning the communication of this information contained in Article 44/1 of the Law of 5 August 1992 on the Police Function have also been supplemented in order to ensure effective international police cooperation.

I read the report and I think things are quite clear. However, I would like to repeat again to this tribune, in order to avoid doubt or ambiguity and to be included in the preparatory work, that the article 134 of the draft proceeding to this amendment is no longer intended to disrupt the existing legal order. In this way, the accessibility to this information, as established by special laws, is not challenged. This is, for example, the case for access to this information by the financial information processing unit, pursuant to article 15, §1 er of the law of 1 January 1993 on the prevention of the use of the financial system for the purposes of money laundering.

Of course, these information crossings will be extremely important. Moreover, it is a number of malfunctions concerning the circulation of information that have been the starting point of this very important reform that we are implementing. So it is very important that, in these information crossroads, contribute not only federal police officers but also local police officers, in nature. This is a guarantee of the proper functioning of these organs.

To what extent will local policemen need to participate? We wanted to avoid an arbitrary rule by introducing a percentage because situations are extremely different depending on the police force, its importance and information needs. It has been attempted to tailor-made clothes and to allow – without generalization – small consumer-low areas with little staff, to contribute financially rather than in nature.

To solve this problem, we must take into account the negotiations that are currently taking place with the Union of Cities and Communes. We are determining what will be the form and importance of the possible financial contribution of the federal authority to the contribution made by the local police to the proper functioning of the CIA.

In addition to these amendments proposed by the government, I would like to thank the commissioners who have formulated, through bills or amendments, a number of extremely positive suggestions and which, for the most part, I have personally been able to approve. These are the proposals of Mr. Leterme, Tant, Vanpoucke, Hendricks, Cortois, Erdekens, D'Hondt and Mrs De Permentier which have been incorporated into the text and which, I believe, improve its quality and, in any case, the functioning of the services.

I add that commissioners have formulated a number of suggestions on which I did not want to express myself immediately because, traditionally, all this is the subject of consultations with trade union organisations. But I found that some of these suggestions were interesting and I committed myself to present them to trade unions, to consult with them and, for many of them, to give a positive opinion.

Finally, in the public session as well as in the committee, I cannot sign my agreement on the amendment proposals reintroduced by the CD&V group. by

As for funding, I would like to reiterate this: Mr. Tant, we actually had an interesting meeting of the group chaired by the Prime Minister with the representatives of the Union of Cities and Communes on Monday. We have seen considerable progress, including Minister Daems for Buildings, Minister Vandenbroucke on the issue of pensions, Minister of Justice on the issue of justice. As far as I am concerned, in particular for the problem of surplus costs, you know that we are progressing well in the assessment of the situation, area by area. I think we will be able to finish it quickly.

I would also like to say that in the five working groups that have been set up to try to determine what are the actual eligible surplus costs, there is already a very broad consensus that I welcome and that goes in the direction of a federal intervention to cover a number of these surplus costs. It remains, but it is quite normal, a few points of discussion of which we will continue to examine.

Finally, it is important that the Prime Minister, on his own behalf and on behalf of the Minister of Budget, reiterates the government’s commitment when the final assessment of all this will be carried out, as part of the budget control that will take place in June and July. If necessary, the means to cope with these expenses should be provided.

Mr. Minister, I hope that the Government 21.16 will indeed fulfill its promises. We are gradually beginning to get a picture of the additional costs. Can you tell in what proportion the additional costs will be borne by the federal and local governments?

Mr. Tant, I understand that you are like St. Thomas and that you only believe what you see!

He was a good Christian.

That’s true and I don’t compare with you, but the work is extremely accurate. I gave the example of the contribution to the CIA, whether it is investment costs, personnel. I gave the example of the special accountant, insurance regarding vehicles and many other things, overtime to consider, weekend benefits, etc. There was a very interesting technical discussion and I confirm to this tribune that a very broad consensus has emerged. There are still a few questions to be solved and I am quite convinced that in the coming days and weeks we will find answers.

Finally, as regards medical care, Mr. Vanpoucke, I am not opposed to a reflection on this question. For now, I have launched a new call for approved doctor candidates and I intend to approve everyone who asks for it. I am very open in this matter. I am determined to conduct, with the Minister of Social Affairs, a very in-depth discussion on this subject, in particular in connection with the problem of the global medical dossier. I am open to all suggestions and I repeated this to Mrs. Avontroodt yesterday in the commission, I do not want to improvise in this matter. The current system is very open and very flexible. If we can improve it, we will do it, but after a serious discussion.

Mr. Cortois, I share your concern regarding, in particular, the capacity of mortgages. This is for me an opportunity to say that most of the means used yesterday in a decentralized manner by the gendarmerie were in the local gendarmerie brigades and were transferred to the local police and therefore are no longer available for the federal police for the moment. The only intervention reserves we have are in the Federal Reserve, which has a little over 1,100 men and which are very often used, whether for order-keeping operations or for one-off assistance operations, for example for funds transportation. There must be a good balance in this area. All the circles I take confirm that I share this concern. For example, I have just taken a circular on the protection of danger stations where I plan on increased intervention by the federal police.

I insist roughly every day with the Prime Minister to advance the famous project allowing the formation of a security corps. I said it to this tribune and I repeat it, almost 500 men are used every year across the entire territory to these problems of transfer of prisoners. I think they are misused from a police point of view and the Prime Minister assures me that, as part of the negotiations and discussions he has with the Ministers of Defense and Justice, things are progressing and that the government can therefore very quickly adopt a draft on this matter.

Mr. Speaker, I would like to especially thank the Commissioners and all Parliamentarians for their positive contribution to this debate. They enriched it and they helped improve it, which I am delighted with. This will be a contribution to a good reform of our police services.